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NBA • Thursday Service Plays • 3/31/16

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    NBA Odds: Thursday, March 31 2016 Opening Line Report and Handicapping
    by Alan Matthews

    Somewhere, Tom Thibodeau must secretly be enjoying the struggles of his Chicago Bulls. That team never had a winning percentage blow .549 under Thibodeau in his five seasons — despite rarely having Derrick Rose — but Thibs was fired this past offseason in part because he rode his players too hard during the season and they were worn down by the playoffs. So the Bulls hired the polar opposite type of guy in Iowa State coach Fred Hoiberg, but this season has been a disaster under the laid-back Hoiberg. Chicago will need a minor miracle to even reach the playoffs despite having All-Star players in Rose (who actually is playing pretty well these days), Jimmy Butler and Pau Gasol. The Bulls’ front office isn’t going to fire Hoiberg after just one season because that would really make them look bad. But clearly something has to be done with this roster in the offseason, including potentially trading Butler. And Thibs is a lock to get a job this summer as his stock has only gone up. He could be hired in Houston, where the Bulls visit Thursday.

    Nets at Cavaliers (-13.5, 210.5)

    Brooklyn lost 139-105 in Orlando on Tuesday for its second straight defeat. It was the second of a back-to-back for the Nets, and they clearly didn’t care. They also rested Rondae Hollis-Jefferson and Thaddeus Young. Both should be back here. LeBron James got Tuesday’s home game vs. Houston off and the Cavs blew a 20-point third-quarter lead in losing 106-100 to the Rockets. Kyrie Irving had 31 points to lead the Cavs, who are now 1-3 this season when James doesn’t play. He’ll surely be back here. James is four points away from passing Dominique Wilkins for 12th place on the NBA’s all-time scoring list. Final meeting of season with Cleveland leading 2-1. The teams played last Thursday in Brooklyn and the Nets pulled a 104-95 surprise even though the Cavs weren’t resting any of their stars.

    Key trends:
    The Nets are 3-0-1 against the spread in the past four meetings. The “over/under” has gone under in those previous four.

    Early lean:
    If LeBron and all the Cavs play, give the points. Go under.

    Magic at Pacers (TBA)

    Orlando destroyed visiting Brooklyn 139-105 on Tuesday for its second straight win. Reserve Andrew Nicholson had 24 points to lead eight Magic players in double figures. It was Orlando’s highest point total in seven years. The Magic shot 61.5 percent from the field, their best in eight seasons. Victor Oladipo returned from injury and played 26 minutes. Nik Vucevic remained out, but he has been practicing and could play here. Ersan Ilyasova is day-to-day with a shoulder sprain that kept him out Tuesday. Indiana lost 98-96 at home to Chicago on Monday. CJ Miles missed a 3-pointer that would have won it as time expired. Orlando is 0-3 vs. Indiana this season and has dropped seven straight and 11 of the past 12 in the series.

    Key trends:
    The Magic are 0-7 ATS in the past seven meetings. The under is 7-3-1 in the previous 11.

    Early lean:
    Pacers won’t blow another home game.

    Bulls at Rockets (TBA)

    First of a TNT doubleheader and will have live betting at sportsbooks. Chicago ended a four-game losing streak with a 98-96 win in Indiana on Tuesday but is still two games outside of the playoff field. Butler made a tiebreaking jumper with 3.7 seconds left. Nikola Mirotic had 28 points, but Rose of course got hurt again, this time an elbow. X-rays were negative, but knowing Rose he won’t play here. Bulls power forward Taj Gibson also is iffy as he missed the second half of Tuesday’s game because of a rib contusion..Chicago beat Houston 108-100 on March 5. Pau Gasol had 28 points and 17 rebounds. The Rockets have won three straight at home vs. the Bulls, however.

    Key trends:
    The home team is 5-0 ATS in the past five meetings. The over is 4-1 in Houston’s past five at home.

    Early lean:
    Rockets in a big way, Rose or not.

    Nuggets at Pelicans (+7, 207)

    Denver was in Memphis on Wednesday. New Orleans was in San Antonio. The Pelicans on Tuesday added two more players to the season-ending injury list: Jrue Holiday and Alonzo Gee. These teams have split two early-season meetings, each winning on the road back in 2015. The Nuggets’ Danilo Gallinari averaged 25.0 points in the two, but he’s now out for the season. Ryan Anderson averaged 20.0 points for New Orleans but also probably is done due to a sports hernia.

    Key trends:
    The road team is 5-0 ATS in the past five meetings. The over is 6-2 in the previous eight.

    Early lean:
    Pelicans, even with their D-League roster, and under.

    Clippers at Thunder (-8.5, 216)

    Second TNT game with live betting. Los Angeles was in Minnesota on Wednesday looking for a fourth straight win. Oklahoma City saw its eight-game winning streak end Tuesday in Detroit, 88-82. After a big win Monday in Toronto that didn’t surprise me — it helped that Billy Donovan gave Kevin Durant and Serge Ibaka the night off. It was OKC’s lowest-scoring game of the season. Russell Westbrook looked tired himself, shooting 8-for-28. These teams won’t meet again this season unless each pulls a playoff upset and they square off in the Western Conference Finals. The Thunder lead 2-1 and won the most recent matchup 120-108 at home on March 9.

    Key trends:
    The home team is 4-1 ATS in the past five meetings. The over is 9-3 in the past 12 in OKC.

    Early lean:
    This really seems like a game that Westbrook and/or the Clippers’ Chris Paul could get off. But, without knowing that I like OKC at home and over.

    Celtics at Trail Blazers (-2, 217)

    Boston had a four-game winning streak snapped in a 114-90 loss at the Clippers on Monday. Isaiah Thomas scored 24 points for Boston, which is now 21-22 this season against teams with a .500 record or better. Portland won a second straight Monday, 105-93 over short-handed Sacramento. Reserve Allen Crabbe led the way with 21 points. The Blazers have won 14 of their last 16 games at home, including five straight. Boston beat Portland 116-93 on March 2 behind 30 points from Thomas. The Blazers are also 4-6 in their past 10 at home in the series.

    Key trends:
    The Celtics are 1-6 ATS in their past seven road games. The favorite is 7-2 ATS in the past nine meetings. The under is 4-0 in Portland’s past four at home.

    Early lean:
    Blazers and over.


    Preview: Brooklyn At Cleveland

    When: 7:00 PM ET, Thursday, March 31, 2016
    Where: Quicken Loans Arena, Cleveland, Ohio

    LeBron James took Tuesday night off to rest and should be refreshed when the Cleveland Cavaliers try to get some revenge for one of their most embarrassing losses against the visiting Brooklyn Nets on Thursday. The Cavaliers dropped a 104-95 decision at Brooklyn a week ago, after which James told reporters, “I just need to do more.”

    James, who responded with a triple-double in a win at New York on Saturday, was desperately needed on Tuesday as Cleveland let a 20-point lead slip away and fell 106-100 to the Houston Rockets. “They were getting to the free-throw line, got us in the bonus early and they never really looked back,” Cavaliers forward Kevin Love told reporters. “We didn’t get the stops that we needed and didn’t play aggressive like we did in the first half, which is ultimately what did it.” The Nets are struggling on their current road trip and lost 110-99 at Miami on Monday to begin the trip before getting trounced 139-105 at Orlando on Tuesday. Brooklyn looked nothing like the team that battled to the end and held the Cavaliers to 12 fourth-quarter points five days’ prior as the Magic shot 61.5 percent from the field and scored at least 30 points in all four periods on Tuesday.

    TV: 7 p.m. ET, YES (Brooklyn), FSN Ohio (Cleveland)

    ABOUT THE NETS (21-53): Brooklyn gave Thaddeus Young the night off and used Brook Lopez and Bojan Bogdanovic for just 15 minutes apiece on Tuesday in order to get a look at the rest of the roster. That roster depth was not very impressive on the defensive end, but at least Thomas Robinson delivered 18 points and 12 rebounds while starting in place of Young. Guard Sean Kilpatrick continued his solid play with 11 points off the bench and has scored in double figures in 10 straight contests.

    ABOUT THE CAVALIERS (52-22): James is not the only player who figures to get extra rest down the stretch, and Cleveland has made health its No. 1 priority heading into the postseason. “I have to listen to the training staff, and if they say guys are banged up a little, or tired, you know, we have to go with that,” Cavaliers coach Tyronn Lue told reporters. “When a guy’s limit is in the red and it gets kind of dangerous, and in the ‘danger zone,’ then we have to tend to have to listen to that.” Cleveland will play two more sets of back-to-backs among the final eight games of the regular season.


    1. Kilpatrick is 0-of-12 from 3-point range in the last four games.

    2. Cavaliers F Channing Frye is 1-of-17 from 3-point range in the last four contests.

    3. Cleveland G Mo Williams is 4-of-4 from 3-point range in the last two games after missing the previous 16 contests with a knee injury.

    PREDICTION: Cavaliers 121, Nets 95


    Preview: Orlando At Indiana

    When: 7:00 PM ET, Thursday, March 31, 2016
    Where: Bankers Life Fieldhouse, Indianapolis, Indiana

    The Indiana Pacers have slipped into eight place in the Eastern Conference, two games ahead of the ninth-place Chicago Bulls. The Pacers will try to improve their standing when they host the suddenly surging Orlando Magic on Thursday.

    Indiana managed just 12 fourth-quarter points in Tuesday’s 98-96 loss and missed a defensive assignment on the final play when Chicago’s Jimmy Butler hit the go-ahead jumper. “Too many lost possessions on the offensive end,” Pacers coach Frank Vogel explained to reporters of the fourth quarter. “Seven turnovers. We settled for perimeter shots. Zero free throws and we missed some open looks.” The Magic played their way out of the playoff chase a long time ago but did the Pacers a favor with a 111-89 win over the Bulls on Saturday before blowing the Brooklyn Nets away 139-105 on Tuesday. “We’re just trying to stay present,” Orlando forward Aaron Gordon told reporters. “This definitely would have meant more if we were chasing a playoff spot, but we’re still improving. We’re still learning and we’re still becoming more familiar with each other.”

    TV: 7 p.m. ET, FSN Florida (Orlando), FSN Indiana

    ABOUT THE MAGIC (31-43): Orlando handed out 32 assists in the win over the Bulls and bumped that number up to 40 while shooting 61.5 percent from the field on Tuesday. “It’s just a great feeling to be out there getting everybody involved and see everybody playing well,” Magic guard Victor Oladipo told reporters. “Everybody on this team works so hard, so it’s fulfilling to see everybody enjoy a night like this.” Reserve forward Andre Nicholson was the best of the bunch against the Nets and went 9-of-9 from the field, including 3-of-3 from beyond the arc, en route to 24 points.

    ABOUT THE PACERS (39-35): Indiana has dropped two of three to fall into eighth but is getting strong play from center Ian Mahinmi in that span. The 29-year-old Frenchman is 23-of-31 from the field in those three games while averaging 18.3 points and 7.7 rebounds. “I felt good,” Mahinmi told the team’s official website after going 9-of-12 from the floor on Tuesday. “I feel like my teammates find me every time I’m open. … I’m in a good rhythm right now.”


    1.Pacers PG Ty Lawson scored eight points on Tuesday – his highest total in six games since joining the team.

    2. Orlando C Nikola Vucevic (groin) has missed the last 13 games but returned to practice and is close to playing in games.

    3. Indiana has taken seven straight in the series by an average of 13.4 points.

    PREDICTION: Pacers 108, Magic 101


    Preview: Chicago At Houston

    When: 7:00 PM ET, Thursday, March 31, 2016
    Where: Toyota Center, Houston, Texas

    The Chicago Bulls kept their diminishing Eastern Conference playoff hopes alive with a tight victory on Tuesday but are still on the outside looking in. The Houston Rockets, who host the Bulls on Thursday, can relate to that plight as they struggle to hang with the pack in the battle for eighth place in the West.

    All-Star guard Jimmy Butler buried a jumper with 3.7 seconds left on Tuesday to lift the Bulls to a 98-96 win at the Indiana Pacers, snapping a four-game slide that had dropped the team under .500 and out of the top eight in the East. Chicago sits two games behind the eighth-place Pacers with eight games left and 2 1/2 south of the No. 7 Detroit Pistons, who visit the Bulls on Saturday. The Rockets overcame a 19-point halftime deficit and dominated the fourth quarter en route to a 106-100 win at Cleveland on Tuesday and will head into play on Wednesday a half-game in front of the Dallas Mavericks for the No. 8 spot in the West. Houston will play five of its final seven games at home, where it owns a 20-16 record.

    TV: 7 p.m. ET, TNT

    ABOUT THE BULLS (37-37): Butler played the hero but it was Nikola Mirotic doing the heavy lifting to keep Chicago in Tuesday’s game. The 25-year-old forward saw his minutes increase when starter Taj Gibson left with a rib contusion and responded by going 7-of-13 from 3-point range en route to a team-high 28 points and 10 rebounds after totaling 17 points in the previous three contests. “I felt great,” Mirotic told reporters. “Coach (Fred Hoiberg) found me some open shots and I was able to hit them, but it’s about the defense. Now we have to carry this effort over to Houston.”

    ABOUT THE ROCKETS (37-38): Houston trailed by as many as 20 points in Tuesday’s win and would like to avoid falling into similar holes moving forward. “Desperation, that’s got to be the feeling,” interim coach J.B. Bickerstaff told reporters. “It’s not panic but it’s desperate. I don’t know how many times that we’ve been down double figures and got down to come back in games. That’s who we’ve been. Again, the desperation needs to start at the tip.” The Rockets end the season with four straight against teams out of the playoff race but first have to get through Chicago, Oklahoma City and Dallas.


    1. Bulls PG Derrick Rose (elbow) is 16-of-54 from the field in the last three games.

    2. Rockets C Dwight Howard only recorded three field goal attempts on Tuesday and has taken eight or fewer shots in nine straight games.

    3. Mirotic was held to seven points but C Pau Gasol delivered 28 points and 17 rebounds in a 108-100 home win over Houston on Mar. 5.

    PREDICTION: Rockets 99, Bulls 94


    Preview: Denver At New Orleans

    When: 8:00 PM ET, Thursday, March 31, 2016
    Where: Smoothie King Center, New Orleans, Louisiana

    The Denver Nuggets have long been out of the playoff race but can finish March off on a high note when they host the New Orleans Pelicans on Thursday. Denver recorded a 109-105 win over the Memphis Grizzlies on Wednesday and a victory over the Pelicans would give the Nuggets a 10-7 record in March.

    Injury-riddled New Orleans had just nine available players for Wednesday’s 100-92 loss to the New Orleans Pelicans. Point guard Jrue Holiday (eye) and forward Alonzo Gee (quadriceps) were the most recent players ruled out for the season and small forward Ryan Anderson (sports hernia) is in jeopardy of sitting out the rest of the slate. Nuggets center Nikola Jokic matched his career high of 14 rebounds against Memphis but has scored in single digits in each of the past four games. Denver is planning on the 21-year-old Jokic to develop into a bona fide starting center.

    TV: 8 p.m. ET, FSN New Orleans, Altitude (Denver)

    ABOUT THE PELICANS (27-47): Forward James Ennis was signed out of the D-League on Wednesday and had 13 points in 24 minutes in his club debut after arriving at the arena shortly before game time. Another recent signee, guard Jordan Hamilton, scored 14 points in his third game and first start and center Alexis Ajinca stood out with 18 points and nine rebounds and then proclaimed afterward that there is plenty to play for. “We are trying to win no matter what — we are looking for a different motivation to push us to win each game,” Ajinca told reporters. “It doesn’t matter if we have five guys, six guys or seven guys; we are still going to play as hard as we can.”

    ABOUT THE NUGGETS (32-44): Backup small forward Will Barton scored 25 points against the Grizzlies and is averaging 24 points while making nine 3-point baskets during the past two games. Barton has carved himself out a role with Denver and has stepped up even further lately with leading scorer Danilo Gallinari (ankle) likely done for the season. Barton, who has started just one game, also has proven to be a capable rebounder and is third on the squad with six boards per game.


    1. The Pelicans are 3-0 against the Nuggets this season and have won the past five meetings.

    2. New Orleans G Norris Cole (back) has missed 12 straight games and is doubtful for Thursday’s game.

    3. Denver C Jusuf Nurkic (illness) has missed the past two games and might return Thursday.

    PREDICTION: Nuggets 107, Pelicans 99


    Preview: L.A. Clippers At Oklahoma City

    When: 9:30 PM ET, Thursday, March 31, 2016
    Where: Chesapeake Energy Arena, Oklahoma City, Oklahoma

    The Los Angeles Clippers aim to pick up their fifth consecutive victory when they visit the Oklahoma City Thunder on Thursday. Los Angeles has been especially good the past three games, winning by an average of 19.7 points after cruising to a 99-79 win over the Minnesota Timberwolves on Wednesday.

    Oklahoma City also has been rolling up the victories but had an eight-game winning streak snapped on Tuesday when it suffered an 88-82 loss to the Detroit Pistons. The Thunder averaged 117.3 points during the stretch of wins before recording a season-low point total against the Pistons on a night in which All-Star small forward Kevin Durant was rested. Los Angeles is thriving and led by as many as 33 points while routing the Timberwolves. The Clippers plan to rest point guard Chris Paul, shooting guard J.J. Redick and center DeAndre Jordan on Thursday.

    TV: 9:30 p.m. ET, TNT

    ABOUT THE CLIPPERS (47-27): Los Angeles is 4 1/2 games behind the third-place Thunder in the Western Conference standings and resting three starters seems to indicate the Clippers feel that rising above fourth place isn’t feasible with just eight games remaining. Los Angeles will get power forward Blake Griffin (hand, suspension) back on Sunday and will have to get Griffin plenty of playing time during the final six games. Backup shooting guard Jamal Crawford has scored in double digits in five straight games and backup point guard Austin Rivers is averaging 13 points over the past two games.

    ABOUT THE THUNDER (52-23): Oklahoma City badly missed Durant during the loss to the Pistons but coach Billy Donovan said he can’t factor in the opponent when it comes to resting a player. “We have to make decisions of what’s best for our team,” Donovan told reporters. “It’s not necessarily who we’re playing against, but where we’re at right now — physically, mentally, emotionally. Games, minutes, all those things, I think you have to evaluate that after games and do what’s best for your team.” All-Star point Russell Westbrook had 24 points for his third consecutive 20-point scoring effort but was just 8-of-28 shooting against the Pistons.


    1. The Thunder are 2-1 against the Clippers this season, including a 120-108 win in Oklahoma City on March 9.

    2. Los Angeles SF Paul Pierce (ankle, knee) isn’t on the road trip and will miss his second straight game.

    3. Oklahoma City backup C Enes Kanter had 14 points and 14 rebounds Tuesday for his 22nd double-double of the season.

    PREDICTION: Thunder 123, Clippers 119


    Preview: Boston At Portland

    When: 10:00 PM ET, Thursday, March 31, 2016
    Where: Moda Center at the Rose Quarter, Portland, Oregon

    Boston All-Star guard Isaiah Thomas seeks his 14th consecutive effort of 20 or more points when the Celtics visit the Portland Trail Blazers on Thursday. Thomas is averaging 26.2 points in March and his streak of 13 straight 20-point outings is three shy of Paul Pierce’s franchise record.

    Boston can move into a virtual tie with the fourth-place Miami Heat in the Eastern Conference with a victory but a loss will prompt a drop behind the Charlotte Hornets into sixth place. The Celtics are 1-1 on a five-game West Coast swing after being routed 114-90 by the Los Angeles Clippers on Monday. Portland is in a tight race in the Western Conference and has a slight chance of chasing down the fifth-place Memphis Grizzlies, but a slump could lead to the Trail Blazers falling out of the race as ninth-place Dallas remains in close proximity. “We just want to get as many wins as we can for the rest of the season,” backup swingman Allen Crabbe told reporters. “We haven’t really talked as a team about where we want to finish, but I feel like our main thing is making the playoffs.”

    TV: 10 p.m. ET, CSN New England (Boston), CSN Northwest (Portland)

    ABOUT THE CELTICS (43-31): Small forward Jae Crowder (high ankle sprain) will likely return from an eight-game absence and Boston has missed his defensive presence. The squad also hasn’t been as cohesive with Crowder out of the lineup and he is averaging 14.4 points, 5.1 rebounds and 1.8 steals in what is easily the best season of his four-year NBA career. Backup center Kelly Olynyk has been struggling since returning from a shoulder injury and has scored in single digits in five of the past seven games.

    ABOUT THE TRAIL BLAZERS (39-36): Standout point guard Damian Lillard is averaging just 15.7 points over the past three games – well below his 25.4 season average – but made it clear he isn’t tired when the subject was broached after Monday’s 105-93 victory over the Sacramento Kings. “Honestly, I don’t even care to really talk about it,” Lillard told reporters. “I’m going to play, that’s the bottom line. Our team is winning games when we need to win games and that’s all that matters.” Shooting guard C.J. McCollum is of the same mindset and he has just one 20-point outings over the past four contests.


    1. Thomas scored 30 points as the Celtics rolled to a 116-93 home victory over the Trail Blazers on March 2.

    2. Portland has won five straight home games and 14 of its last 16.

    3. Boston PF Jared Sullinger is averaging 6.7 points on 11-of-39 shooting over the past four games.

    PREDICTION: Trail Blazers 113, Celtics 107


    Hot teams
    — Cavaliers won three of last four home games (1-4 last 5HF).
    — Clippers won their last four games (7-7AU). Oklahoma City won eight of its last nine games (5-3 last 8HF).
    — Celtics won four of their last five games (2-9 last 11AU). Portland is 3-1 in its last four games (0-3 last 3HF).

    Cold teams
    — Magic lost their last six road games (2-5 last 7AU). Indiana is 3-4 in its last seven games (3-5 last 8HF).
    — Nets lost five of their last seven games (2-6 last 8AU).
    — Chicago lost four of its last five games (2-4 last 6AU). Houston lost four of its last six games (1-7 last 8HF).
    — Nuggets lost six of their last nine games (4-1AF). Pelicans lost seven of last ten games (2-3 last 5HU).

    Series records
    — Pacers won/covered last seven games with Orlando.
    — Nets lost six of their last eight games with Cleveland.
    — Bulls won three of last four games with Houston.
    — Nuggets won five of last seven games with New Orleans.
    — Clippers lost three of last four visits to Oklahoma.
    — Celtics won last two games with Portland, after losing previous four.

    — Seven of last nine Indiana games stayed under the total.
    — Five of last six Brooklyn-Cleveland games stayed under.
    — Six of last seven Chicago games stayed under the total.
    — Six of last eight Denver-New Orleans games went over.
    — Six of last nine Clipper-Thunder games stayed under.
    — Last four Portland games stayed under the total.

    — Denver is 6-3 vs spread last nine times they played night before.
    — Clippers are 7-9 vs spread if they played the night before.


    StatFox Super Situations™ – FoxSheets

    Play Under – Road teams where the total is greater than or equal to 200 revenging a same season loss vs opponent, off an upset win as an underdog
    82-41 over the last 5 seasons. ( 66.7% | 36.9 units )
    17-12 this year. ( 58.6% | 3.8 units )

    Play On – Road favorites of -165 to -500 vs. the money line (DENVER) revenging a straight up loss vs opponent as a favorite, with a losing record
    97-24 since 1997. ( 80.2% | 47.3 units )
    4-3 this year. ( 57.1% | -2.4 units )

    Play On – Favorites vs. the 1rst half line (CLEVELAND) an explosive offensive team (>=102 PPG) against a good offensive team (98-102 PPG) after 42+ games, after allowing 105 points or more
    97-52 over the last 5 seasons. ( 65.1% | 39.8 units )
    31-20 this year. ( 60.8% | 9.0 units )



    1* (711) Celtics +3



    Portland Trail Blazers -165 over Boston Celtics


    NBA Basketball Betting Trends – Thurs – March, 31

    Orlando at Indiana, 7:05 ET
    Orlando: 10-1 ATS after a blowout win by 15 points or more
    Indiana: 19-37 ATS after playing 4 consecutive games as favorite

    Brooklyn at Cleveland, 7:05 ET
    Brooklyn: 20-9 ATS in road games off a road loss
    Cleveland: 27-39 ATS as a favorite

    Chicago at Houston, 7:05 ET
    Chicago: 2-9 ATS off an upset win as an underdog
    Houston: 27-11 after 2 consecutive non-conference games

    Denver at New Orleans, 8:05 ET
    Denver: 13-4 ATS in road games after one or more consecutive overs
    New Orleans: 0-7 ATS in home games after 2 or more consecutive unders

    LA Clippers at Oklahoma City, 9:35 ET
    Los Angeles: 14-5 ATS revenging a same season loss vs opponent
    Oklahoma City: 8-20 ATS after a non-conference game

    Boston at Portland, 10:05 ET
    Boston: 20-9 ATS after having won 2 of their last 3
    Portland: 14-31 ATS at home revenging a road loss vs opponent of 20 pts or more

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